beyond saturn

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chintu825
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beyond saturn

Post by chintu825 »

The planets beyond saturn(uranus and neptune) were discovered 200 or less years ago. How does that affect astrology? Should we first make observations of thousands of horoscopes before attributing characteristics to the new planets. I mean can't we wait for 2000 more years and gather data for the two planets. This will certainly prove useful as astrologers will be able to prove that Astrology has some scientific and socially relevant face. Most of my atheist friends always criticize me for being superstitious and ignorant. While I believe in Western Astrology(which explains materialistic ramifications of your horoscope) for obvious reasons I don't have anything against vedic astrology.
I am sure astrologers world over will show some patience in predicting outcomes of neptune and uranus.
tmr
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by tmr »

The reason why Uranus and Neptune are ignored in Vedic Astrology is due to the fact that they remain in a sign for more than a normal human lifespan. Uranus is in one sign for 84 years and Neptune some 164+ years. And their impact on human life are more of a different one which hardly changes in one's life time.
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by Mersenne »

Hi chintu825,

Neptune's orbit of around 165 years has fallen nicely within the time of its discovery, so experience has been gained with it. Uranus, even more so. But you raise a fine point with respect to "new" planets in general.

Certainly we can learn a lot less of the slow-moving planets than the fast. But we can gain a reasonable idea of their influence as they participate in aspects with other planets. That's why I've confined my studies to the aspects- you'll find I've supplied keywords for, say "Eris in negative relation to Mercury", but not "Eris in Gemini". We could also see how they operate in historical charts, but even here it's wise to confine onself to aspect relationships, since sign-placement will change so less often.

Salutations tmr,

I'm not well versed in vedic astrology, but your observation is an interesting one. From the Western perspective, however, the influence of even a slow-moving planet changes through a lifetime, because the aspects made to it from the other planets (in transit and progression) change, by comparison, quite rapidly.
See on this Forum:
Mersenne’s Astrological Statistics & Datasets
Mersenne’s Microcosm
Mersenne’s Transneptunians
tmr
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by tmr »

Recent discoveries have shown that there are many more galaxies in the universe than we ever thought there were and they do have influence on the Milky way too and solar system is only one of the systems in the Milky way. Pluto is no more considered as a Planet and therefore we can never have a proper understanding of how these can influence on a human life. We are totally being led by what is written in the ancient scripts pertaining to Astrology. Probably that is why Vedic Astrology ignores Uranus, Neptune and Pluto. In my 50 years of research in Astrology, I have never been able to convince myself that these two planets Uranus and Neptune can have any impact on human life neither by placement nor by aspects. Fast moving planets may be aspecting the slow moving ones which itself is not sure to have any influence on humans. We are completely at the mercy of hypothesis.
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by Mersenne »

Thanks for your contribution, Raj, worth much more than 2 cents as usual.

Western astrology has always felt obliged to incorporate new discoveries. In recent years these have proliferated so that the we've had to admit their effect must be very limited- I have supposed Transneptunians to have considerably less influence than any "traditional" planet. It may indeed be that we are presumptuous in attributing any effect to those planets not visible to the naked eye. But, the symbolic associations of at least Neptune and Uranus (and their equivalents) are so important in Western mythologies, I feel they cried out for notice- witness Neptune's contribution to Jung's celebrated synchronistic run of fishes.

Hi tmr,

A planet is what we astrologers say is a planet- even if astronomers claim it's a star or satellite! I've suggested a kind of law of diminishing returns for the new discoveries, so that each new one contributes so much less than the previous.
See on this Forum:
Mersenne’s Astrological Statistics & Datasets
Mersenne’s Microcosm
Mersenne’s Transneptunians
chintu825
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by chintu825 »

It is necessary to know the effects of Uranus and Neptune on individual scale. The effects of these planets on humanity are known, but we cannot apply these to individuals. We will first have to initiate a worldwide effort to gather data of all individuals and make deductions from this data. Our future generations will benefit from our toil.
We will need a fresh branch of astrology to study the effect of asteroids and space matter on earth(and humanity).
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by admin »

Yes chintu825, Uranus and Neptune and also Pluto need to be researched with respect to their effects on an individual scale and have indeed, after many years of research, been shown to have an effect in individual/personal charts. Of course, their revolutions around the zodiac are longer than that of the inner planets . However, when these 'outer planets' aspect the inner planets, it is clearly apparent that they do have an effect/reflect inner patterns/energies.

Inevitably, as we grow and move forward, just as those 'outer' planets reflect and have described that growth, (look at the periods when Uranus, Neptune and Pluto were discovered) we are moving forward and need to change. And the same now with the new 'planetoids'.

Here, Mersenne is looking at these new discoveries of ‘planetoids’ beyond Pluto, and attempting to gather information about such statistically.

As we grow, we discover more possibilities within us, as new realms become open to us. We can't stop it, anymore than we can do so with all new discoveries. Surely it's better to try to understand it. rather than deny it ?

Admin.
"Don't let the illusions of your past or future rob you of the infiniteness of your present." [Unknown]
chintu825
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by chintu825 »

I agree. We must isolate all the stuff that affects humans in some way or the other. One thought just crossed my mind. What would happen if we terraform mars and start living on it?. Would we consider Earth just a planet or planet with life and predict the fate of Martians. We must consider planetoids,comets,asteroids,space junk like meteors etc that affect us. More research is required.
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by admin »

I read one article recently: http://www.smh.com.au/national/2024-a-s ... 3b2qt.html which may interest you. What upset me was the phrase: ""Either we spread Earth to other planets or we risk going extinct," he said at a Wall Street Journal conference in May. "An extinction event is inevitable and we're increasingly doing ourselves in." Hellooee ! How about working on where we live before giving up on it ? I understand that it's feeling hopeless at the moment, but why give up ? Don't mistake my words here for meaning not travelling forth into all of these new worlds. I surely understand the need to reach and discover such. And if I were really rich, would back such ventures...though not this 'Big Brother' model.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/2024-a-s ... z37nxB8wPy

Best,
Admin.
"Don't let the illusions of your past or future rob you of the infiniteness of your present." [Unknown]
chintu825
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Re: beyond saturn

Post by chintu825 »

This link for those who doubt astrology
http://www.theastrologyplace.uk/2011/08 ... -H-IPmSz4U
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